Monday, July 6, 2009

Epiphany

I had the occasion to spend some time with a dear friend and sister in the faith last week. It was a tremendous blessing since we haven’t had many opportunities in recent months to just sit together and talk. She works full time and while I am always encouraged and honored to talk with her over the phone, days like the one we shared are extra special to me.

She recounted an “epiphany” she had recently that is sure to change her life and the life of her family forever. It will be an adjustment, but certainly a change for the better. I’m sharing a bit of it here because I was having a similar epiphany on the other side of town on the exact same day as she was having hers.

She had a matter to attend to at a local business. It was a very large company where security officers could be seen at various places in the building. Several of them were women, in the standard unisex uniforms. At that moment she said that The Savior began to speak to her heart and tell her that what she was seeing around her was a total reversal of order. That this was not the role He created woman to fill. That if every one of those women who had a family was at home instead of where she was, there would be no job shortage, our children wouldn’t be confused and out of control, and more families would remain intact. Oh yes, and that she needed to make preparations to go back home full time-and soon.

If you knew my friend you would know that this was no small revelation. She is a very strong woman, who joyfully submits to her husband and loves her children, but prides herself on her independence and ability to achieve. Her perspective is actually quite common among women in the church today, among women in general, and especially among African-American women. In fact, my friend is in a management position at her place of employment. She has always respected my role as a full time homemaker, and has always known my perspective on this issue, but never felt any great conviction to come home herself, feeling that each family is free on this matter to follow their own conscience before the Heavenly Father. Do you recall my saying that among black women, very few would even know what you mean when you mention the "mommy wars"?

As she recounted her revelation to me, I was floored because I was having a similar experience on the same day. I was at a local retail outlet, waiting to check out, and the patron ahead of me had a price discrepancy, which meant the manger needed to be called. When the manager approached, I noted the wedding rings on her hand as they were quite beautiful, practically begging to be noticed. I thought to myself that with all of the men looking for work right now, if every married woman was at home serving her family there would be far fewer men without a job. I really don’t know where the thought came from as I am quite used to the realities of women in the workplace, but it occurred to me nonetheless.

I know there are tens, if not hundreds of extenuating circumstances and realities of life that validate the hundreds of thousands of women who wake up every morning and must enter the rat race. I also realize that many men, including my friend’s husband, are quite comfortable with their wives holding a job and financial realities are such that most families wouldn’t even know where to begin to streamline their finances and reduce their debt load enough to live on one income. If a husband desires that his wife work, I believe that she is to submit to her husband as unto the Lord and honor his wishes. However, as my friend rightly pointed out, believers are called to come out from among the world’s systems and do things God’s way. In addition, she added that it’s our disobedience, individually, and as the church corporately, that has created this twisted mess we have now. Unsupervised children. Families not taking care of their own. Churches not defending and providing for the widow and the orphan.

I am particularly sensitive to this issue as it relates to the black community. I have written about it before, and will refrain from belaboring the point too much again, but the staggering illegitimacy and incarceration rates that have crippled these communities and our children in them are directly related to numbers of absent fathers and the resulting high numbers of mothers with their attention divided between parenting and providing. This same lack of focus is often present when married mothers are preoccupied with both parenting and providing. Problems that could be addressed and halted early on in the lives of children often go unnoticed until they’ve reached a crisis point.

I am thrilled in ways I can hardly begin to express when an African-American, believing wife and mother, along with her husband, answers the call to live the Titus 2 mandate. It takes us one step closer to a day when the words “traditional black family” don’t sound like an oxymoron. I realize that this is an issue that transcends ethnic considerations, since some would say that we are in living in an era that is "post-family", where the nuclear family is largely becoming obsolete. Given that the family is the God-given foundation for societal stability, I find this line of thinking to be very problematic.

The truth hurts, but someone needs to tell it. The reason that delinquency and illegitimacy rates are no smaller within the church than without is because our lives are no different than that of the world. We live the exact same lifestyles. Is it any wonder that in our families we would get the exact same results? We have deluded ourselves long enough. Albert Eintein said that insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different outcome. Why do we think that dragging our madness to church with us obligates God to bless it?


By the way, there are ways for a wife to be a financial blessing to her family without abdicating her post to do it. But I’ll have to take that thought up another day. Stay tuned!

41 graceful responses:

Mrs. C said...

It may also be the fact that people *seem to generally* rather hire a black WOMAN than a black MAN that contributes to this discrepancy you're viewing.

(I hope I'm wrong. Will be happy to see you tell me so.)

Cafe Mocha Momma said...

Terry,

I must admit that I've never considered the effect of women working on the available job pool for men. Of course, it goes without saying that the effect on the family is obvious.

In my family of "strong Black women," I am the only one who is not pursuing a career of some sort. It is a blessing and a privilege to be home with my chidren. But it's not easy. It requires a great deal of resourcefulness, creativity, and prayer to make it on one income. Practically-speaking, I think that a great deal of Titus 2-ing and mentoring would need to take place before a significant change could occur. Our women have been sharing, and sometimes bearing alone, the load of providing for the family for so long. Where would they begin to change the status quo?

I often wonder how did our grandmothers and great grandmothers do it. Many, if not most, of them had to work as a matter of necessity. Yet, they were still able to lovingly, prayerfully be there for their families. What's missing in our time to that equation?

The Henderson Family said...

Great post Terry, what good news about your friend's revelation!! It is truly sad to see so many women working and in the military. I especially hate to see a woman leaving husband and children to go and serve in the armed forces overseas. How awful, how backward, and how horrible for the family. This is not the way God intended for women to live. I pray more woman, like your friend will be convicted about their true calling.

Craig and Heather said...

Well stated, Terry.
I've often though similarly about how women (of all colors) who don't really need to work have created a kind of saturation of the work force and reduced the number of jobs available to men. I don't have any real answers, though as it isn't my job to dictate how others should live. I suppose God has to speak to each of us individually.

This:
************************
Why do we think that dragging our madness to church with us obligates God to bless it?
**************************
about sums up what I've been thinking about a lot of things we have tried to "sanctify" by sticking a Christian label on them.



Of course we have to work, eat and clothe ourselves in this world. And there are "debatable matters" which require that we interact in a loving, gracious manner...but why do we tend to overlook instructive Scriptural text like

Hebrews 13:5-6 "Let your way of life be without the love of money, and be content with such things as you have, for He has said, "Not at all will I leave you, not at all will I forsake you, never!"
so that we may boldly say, "The Lord is my helper, and I will not fear what man shall do to me."

The Bible says that an attitude of contentment allows us to be able to BOLDLY state that the Lord is my helper!

Even though we live in an economically depressed area, God has always made sure Craig has had a job and we have had enough money for essentials. But over the years, as he began to make more money, our desire to be "more comfortable" also grew and we selfishly mismanaged a lot of the surplus income.

Craig and I were recently discussing how our lack of contentment and thankfulness in simply knowing and obeying Christ has caused us not only some financial cramps but also created the perception that WE needed to come up with some sort of plan to continue in our world-focused lifestyle. The effects of greed were becoming apparent in our children, too. Although our consumerism never got to the point where it looked like I needed to get a job, I know it was still sinful.

God has been faithful to show us some things and our hearts have been granted repentance and a sense of contentment with what we have. I am sad to see what opportunities to serve we have squandered but thankful God got our attention while we still have a chance to change.

I guess my point is that as I look back, it doesn't surprise me at all to see that some of our roughest/driest spiritual times were when we had abandoned God's way to try to conform our lives to the standards of this world. Out of love for His disobedient children, He did not bless our self-centered efforts.

H

Armchair Housewife said...

Well said, Terry.

I also continue to grow concerned for the men in the church, and how the Lord is going to hold them accountable for the fact that they have failed to lead and have allowed their wives to carry the burden of their curse- that of toil in work. I see so many women worn out and without the physical, emotional, and spiritual energy that they need to be good wives, mothers, and servants in the church and the community at large. And far too often I see men abdicating their responsibilities as provider and should their wife suggest wanting to stay home, they accuse her of being lazy and needing to get out there and get a job. Men and women both are totally brainwashed by the post- feminist worldly thinking that if you aren't getting a paycheck you aren't contributing.

Since God opened my eyes to the issue of gender roles in the past few years, I have been almost exclusively frustrated with my fellow women, and our part in throwing off the beautiful God-ordained roles that He created for us, and our roles in tearing down our men and our marriages in the process. But more and more I am seeing the way the men are responsible as well, and ultimately responsible as far as God is concerned, for the direction their families go, and so I really pray for and encourage the strong men in our church who have a heart for servant leadership, and pray as well for those sisters of mine who's hearts are increasingly towards home but do not have men who will encourage and support them.

Thanks for talking about the important stuff!

-Nicole

Terry @ Breathing Grace said...

Actually, Mrs. C, I'm not sure that you ARE wrong, sad as it isto say.

Heather, I think there are very few of us who cannot attest to the experience of viewing seasons of plentyas opportunity for excess rather than an opportunity to bless others or even follow the example of the ant as outlined in Proverbs.

Mrs.Henderson, how great to hear from you! I hope your summer is going well.

Cafe Mocha Momma, My experience is much like your own. Up until one of my sisters-in-law stopped came back home last year, I was the one and only woman in my family, or even my circle of close Christian friends, who was NOT pursuing a career. And you're also correct about the sacrifices required to do this. When times are tight, the mind begins to entertain all kinds of thinking.

Terry @ Breathing Grace said...

Hey, Nicole! Your words are true, sister. We, as the church need to lead by example. I honestly believe with all my heart that if just the families of believers were to be transformed and embraced God's order, we would see a tremendous change in the society in which we live. But sadly, we have become just another sub-culture in this world rather than being a transformative counter-culture.

Erin said...

What an awesome word from the Lord your friend received! That's so cool, I love testimonies like that.

My DH and I have often discussed how many more jobs would be available to men if women would go back to being at home. The incredible effect it would have on family, and thereby, culture, is obvious (at least to some of us).

Catherine R. said...

Great post Terry. I can't even imagine the world-changing effects if the women who were *able* (and let's face it many are able but not willing), took the steps to stay home.

Anonymous said...

I'll not pretend that being a working mom is easy, but it's doable. My life isn't a mess. My marriage is good. My home life is good. The reality is if I quit my job, these things probably wouldn't be good. Our debt would go up, our stress would go up. I would see my husband less because he would have to take on an additional job.

I am a Christian, I love the Lord. I serve Him. But I don't hold Titus 2 as a mandate. In fact, my bible actually says to be busy at home. And busy I am!!

I know this isn't going to change your mind. But I just wanted to give you a different perspective.


Nurse Bee

Armchair Housewife said...

Terry,

I got thinking some more on this and i know this is a tangent, but I am curious about your thoughts here and it seemed applicable enough to include in this discussion. As much as you and I agree that more women at home would be better all around, would you be glad, concerned, or indifferent if things suddenly took a dramatic turn and women were no longer *allowed* to participate in the work force as they currently do. For instance, the example you gave of female security gaurds. I am sure 30-40 years ago (or less) those same security companies would have never hired a woman, might have even had it as written policy. Now, that would be illegal. How would you feel, or more importantly what would you think, if laws were repealed and companies were allowed to "discriminate" and only hire men?

I ask you because to be honest I don't know what I think about that. Part of me says we have only been hurt by the flight of women from the home to the workforce and if companies were allowed to only hire men, or laws were changed, etc, then so be it. But there's another part of me that says the law shouldn't be involved, and that discrimination isn't right, but that it should be the personal, heart decision of women (and their husbands if they are submissive Christian wives) as to whether or not a woman enters the workforce.

I know your post was about women and men choosing what was right, not about the legality of things, but I wonder about your take on that. More food for thought!

-Nicole

Terry @ Breathing Grace said...

Oh, Nurse Bee!

This was absolutely, positively, NOT about condemnation. In fact, I thought I was crystal clear about the fact that financial realities for many families mean that some wives MUST work. I also never said that it was a sin. You and I have had this conversation a few times before. HAVING to go to work and choosing not to make the sacrifices required to exercise the option are two different things. It's interesting that Nicole, the Armchair Housewife who also left a comment, is a working wife and didn't feel attacked at all.

What I AM saying, and say without apology, is that families fare best when the ideal (and I do believe that this is the Biblical ideal) is strived for. Can we honestly look around us, see the havoc that has been wreaked on the family since women left the home en masse, and NOT admit that society is the worse for it?

I would never question the faith of a working wife. I had never questioned the faith of my working wife friend. In fact, she has always been one of the first people I confide in and got prayer from (after my husband of course). And I have had this confidence in her and her spiritual integrity all while she has been a working wife.

I think that we must at least be willing to be honest enough to say this:

My inability to achieve the ideal doesn't make it any less ideal.

God's Dancing Child said...

Terry,
How wonderful! God is so good! Thank you for sharing this praise report. I love hearing when other women heed God's call to work hard from their home.

I do have one concession, the same one I always have, but it's been a bit since I've mentioned it here (that I can recall, if not, forgive the dripping faucet ;) ). I guess it's not a concession. It's a genuine question.
You say, and rightly so, that Titus 2 is a mandate from God.

How do you say in one breath that Titus 2 is a mandate from God, but in another breath, say that it's okay to break that mandate to obey a mere mortal (our husband)? How do those two things roll together for you personally?
I believe in submission to a husband. However, if our husband's were to ask us to smoke crack, I am sure that you (or any of us here) would tell a wife to not submit to that.
Ironically, there's nothing directly in Scripture that states it's a sin to use drugs (I believe it is a sin, but the direct reference is not there, called an adiaphora), yet there is direct reference to sinning (blaspheming) if not keeping the home.
If a woman is not sinning by obeying her husband by working outside the home, and thereby abdicating her God-ordained and mandated post, is she then not sinning if she obeys her husband and uses drugs?

I know that sounds really ridiculous, but I am curious about what your answer would be to something that's not directly pointed to in Scripture when you have answered the question of what you believe a wife should do regarding an issue that is directly pointed to in Scripture.

I have reread this and thought it looks a little "snarky" but I promise it's not intended. I just don't know how to rephrase it at all.

Terry @ Breathing Grace said...

I'm just curious Nurse Bee, and this not an attack, because you know that I have said that your job can certainly be an avenue for ministry, but I have to ask a question: Which part of this is not a mandate?
***********************************
1But as for you, speak the things which are proper for sound doctrine,: 2 that the older men be sober, reverent, temperate, sound in faith, in love, in patience; 3 the older women likewise, that they be reverent in behavior, not slanderers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things— 4 that they admonish the young women to love their husbands, to love their children, 5 to be discreet, chaste, homemakers, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God may not be blasphemed.
6 Likewise, exhort the young men to be sober-minded, 7 in all things showing yourself to be a pattern of good works; in doctrine showing integrity, reverence, incorruptibility,[a] 8 sound speech that cannot be condemned, that one who is an opponent may be ashamed, having nothing evil to say of you.

***********************************

I only ask because we (and I include me in my folly as well) are far too quick to say that something isn't madated Scripturally, you know?

Terry @ Breathing Grace said...

God's Dancing Child:

I believe that the greater sin would be the dissolution of the marriage, and financial stress is THE BIGGEST reason why couples divorce. Which is better? That a wife come home and the stress level reaches a point where the marriage becomes unworkable? And the children become the product of a broken home, and at risk for all of the pathologies that we know come from that? The Bible says that even in an unequally yoked marriage the staying together of that couple sanctifies the children, no?

Of course, the husband could certainly say that she is sinning by not submitting to his authority.
I believe that the wife should patiently submit to her husband, praying for the God who turns the hearts of kings to turn the heart of her husband? I also think whether or not the husband is a believer is something to be considered. Life is messy.

I've seen my own brother call his wife home after she spent many years prayerfully and patiently submitting to his leadership. I shudder to think where my nieces/nephews would be today had she said "Well, I don't care what you say. I'm not going to work anymore."

I know my answer may seem all over the place but I don't think it's as cut and dry as we'd like to believe it is. For those women who work for their own selfish reasons, it is. But not every working woman is in willful rebellion against God.

I believe the beginiing of evaluating sin and righteousness is to start with Exodus 20- the 10 commandments. I believe that plan of salvation is clear. and I believe that we do our best, at all costs, to live out life as outlined in Scripture. But none of us, I repeat, none of us, has it all together. And we ALL need the grace of God to bear us up in the areas where we fall short- for whatever reason.

Armchair Housewife said...

Just wanted to say I think God's Dancing Child definitely raises a good point, one to consider, and one I have wondered about myself in the past. I'm not sure i have an easy answer to that one.

Terry @ Breathing Grace said...

Yes, Nicole, God's Dancing Child does make a good point, and my conclusion is the same as yours- there are no easy answers.

Life is messy. People like me, who don't have to wrestle with this particular question, can easily say to the next sister, "it's as simple as this or that."

But you know what, I have things in my life that I struggle with that another sister may not, and she could say the same thing to me.

The reality is this. There are many men- believing men- who are as much a product of this feminist indoctrinated society as the women are. And for most of them, the idea of a woman who doesn't work is unheard of. Does it mean that they are not saved? Does it mean that their wives are not saved?

I do believe this with all my heart, and my friend is a perfect example of it: Those with a heart for the Father, who revere His word and make every effort to walk upright before Him, will have the truth revealed to them. I believe that. I believe that as times grow darker we will see more and more of His people awake and begin to separate themsleves from the world's way of doing business.

Armchair Housewife said...

Well Amen, sister.

Jules said...

Kelly Willard has a song, "Who will bring the children?" which addresses some of the issues you raised. If both parents are working full-time, who is going to lead little hearts and minds to the feet of Jesus? Not the caregiver - I know, because I'm an early childhood teacher working in a Christian centre where we are free to talk about spiritual things and yet rarely do the children come to us with their questions. We might have some impact on their lives, but not as much as a mother at home full-time caring for her little ones and whose heart's desire is to see them come to Christ.

I'm a working wife and mother and I wasn't at all offended by your post. As you pointed out (I think in one of your replies) there are many reasons why a woman might have to work outside the home but I believe there are also ways to minimise the damage to her family. I wrote about some of them here (skip the first few paragraphs): http://julesoneagleswings.blogspot.com/2008/07/who-will-lead-children.html

I struggle with this issue myself. I've prayed about it and have even considered giving up my work, and yet, I don't feel that God is leading me in that direction. Yet.

I'm blessed in that I am home when my children are home. Currently the children (I shouldn't call them children - they're well and truly teenagers now) have school holidays and I'm home with them. I'm also home when they get home from school and I've arranged my hours so that I can fulfil my household responsibilities when they're still at school. I don't work fulltime and have no desire to work fulltime and am in fact hoping to reduce my hours soon.

I understand the struggle too that your friend has had. We are torn between our family and our employer. I've been offered more hours and more responsibility and there's a part of me that would like to take it - but then I remind myself that it's my family that's important to me and I have no problem turning down the offer.

You might not agree with my decision or the choices I've made but I have always appreciated your honesty and the way you are not afraid to write about what God has laid on your heart.

I look forward to your next post. Blessings, Jules

Brenda said...

Oh how exciting for your friend!!!!! That is so cool. I remember it all how it first occured to us that perhaps I should be at home with the girls (I couldn't find child care for the upcoming year). I realized I was qualified to keep them. What a revelation, huh? :0

That is very neat to read. I'll be interested to hear how her story plays out. I love it when God works like that!

char said...

How exciting for your friend! I, of course, grew up with the world telling me I could be anything I wanted to be and have everything. It was just a few years back that I realized that the world had been lying to me all a long! No one ever mentioned the fact that I did not NEED to be "anything" to be something. I could be a wife and mom and only then would I truely have everything. You said "many men, including my friend’s husband, are quite comfortable with their wives holding a job". My husband grew up in the same lies and it never occured to him that he may WANT me to be home full time and he definately never thought I would want it. When I realized and expressed my desire he was more than happy to have me home. Now that it has been a few years he says "NO WAY" to me going back to work. Times are hard but we know that God will bless when we do what he created us to do. The world may only see what they consider negatives -older cars, the downsizing of the home, the thrift store/garage sale shopping-but we can see the true blessings on our family. And I could really feel my husband's love for me when we realized that he loves me being home more than he hates that we are usually broke! Now that we have seen the light, we will not give up on God's plan for financial reasons(or any others)and we know he will not be giving up on us.

Mrs. Anna T said...

Wonderfully put, Terry. It used to be easy to live on one income. Now it's nearly impossible in many cases, because of the reasons you mentioned.

Anonymous said...

I am not sure how I feel about the thought that women should stay home so there are more jobs for men. For some reason that line of thought doesn't sit well with me. I believe that a woman who is a wife and mother should always put their home first but that doesn't say she can't have a career too.

I think that I see this as more of a heart issue. One of the above comments had this snippet at the end.

"I often wonder how did our grandmothers and great grandmothers do it. Many, if not most, of them had to work as a matter of necessity. Yet, they were still able to lovingly, prayerfully be there for their families. What's missing in our time to that equation?"


Our grandmothers went to work because their families and country needed them to, not because they were pursuing their own agenda.

I think what is missing is not that women are physically away from their home its that we are taught that its all about "Me" when it should be all about our home and those we love living there. We don't allow our jobs and careers to be second in our hearts because we are so worried about being the best.

I am currently a stay at home wife, not by my choice but I think that God has used this time to change my heart. Even though I "kept" house while having a career I was still focused on my and my successes. I am learning to put my husband and his happiness before my own. I know that when I do return to work it will be with a new heart and a clearer focus.

Kyla Jean

Terry @ Breathing Grace said...

Kyla Jean,

I do think there is something to be said for the fact that a workforce awash with women has damaged prospects for men in the marketplace and also has done a fair amount to increase the cost of living in general so that many families are indeed under pressure to have two incomes just to make it.

I agree with you that it is a heart issue, but we must be oh-so-careful about putting too much stock in our deceitful hearts (that's how the Bible describes our hearts, not me). We cannot get around the fact that the Bible paints a clear picture of God's design for the family. It offends the sensibilities, I know. It offends mine. But the truth is the truth is the truth. And given that we can CLEARLY see the results of us upending His order and doing what we think is "right for us", I stand incredulous that we insist that it is okay for us to outsource the raising of our kids because we "feel called to something else."

When Cafe Mocha Momma mentioned women who worked out of necessity she was actually referring to the fact that for African-American women, work was a necessity as a result of our station and place in society. Our men were woefully undervalued (they were called "boys" even by the youngest white males), and as a result they were woefully underpaid, meaning that their wives HAD to work. This was not the case for white women who also worked out of necessity to support their country during the war, but afterwards went back home so that their men would have jobs when they came home as American heores. Not so for the Black men.

Not trying to pick a fight, but when I look around the communities were I grew up and see the what has become of an entire race of people as we have thrown off the boundaries God put in place for our good and the good of our families, I shudder that we actually argue about this kind of stuff.

Anonymous said...

Terry,

I wasn't trying to argue with you at all. I think that you and I agree on much more than we disagree on...

I also didn't realize that the comment I quoted was directed at Black women only. I was thinking about my grandmother who always had a business or a job (because of WW2) but would be described by those who knew her as a mother, wife and housekeeper. Because the work she did was for her family not for her own wealth or successes.

I too agree that we as humans our hearts are deceitful, but I think that we can get so caught up on watching other Christian's actions that we forget to see if their hearts are in the right place.

I am really sorry if I came across as argumentative.

Kyla Jean

Craig and Heather said...

Check out Proverbs 31 :o)

The woman appeared to deal in both textiles and real estate, was BUSY both in and outside of her home and was involved in her community.

I noted some things:

It appears she was an entrepreneur and didn't answer to a "boss" other than her husband and
Her family did not suffer for her business activities but rather held her in high esteem.

In Paul's letters, he instructed "slaves" as well as "husbands and wives". I'm guessing that some of those slaves (male and female) would have been married and had families yet were instructed to obey their masters as though they were obeying the Lord.

Translated to modern culture, many Americans ARE in fact a type of "slave" regardless of our being told we live in the "land of the free". Some have no choice but to work in order to eat--others are trying to pay off debt.

With that perspective in mind I submit:

" Let each one remain in the calling in which he was called.
Were you called as a slave? It does not matter to you, but if you are able to become free, use it rather.
For he who is called a slave in the Lord is a freed man of the Lord. And likewise, he who is called a free man is a slave of Christ.
You are bought with a price, do not be the slaves of men.
Each in whatever way he was called, brothers, in this remain with God. "1 Corinthians 7:20-24

The point? If you don't *need* to work for someone else, Paul says it is desirable to obtain your freedom. That makes sense as human instruction often contradicts God's and can divide our sense of loyalty to Him. If you are "stuck" in your current job, He wants you to serve Him to the best of your ability (be a good employee, live your faith, etc)right where you are.

Just a little something to toss into the pot ;o)

Terry @ Breathing Grace said...

Kyla Jean,

No problem. I think women like your grandmother, who ran a business of her own, are like the Proverbs 31 woman, and I am a firm believer and supporter in entrepeneurialship for women who want to be a blessing to their families financially. But that, in my opinion is vastly different from a career where we are beholden to someone else's scheduling, their priorities, and demands on the time we can or cannot be there for our families.

I also think this issue is bigger than race, but I corrected you on that one comment because I knew she was talking about a more narrow scope than women in general.

Things are different now. Folks were more family friendly during our grandmothers' day. That is why she could still be known as a housewife. She wasn't asked to choose. But today's women are told point blank: If you want to excel, you MUST put your career first. No option. You must travel if the job requires, work late if the job requires, miss soccer games if the job requires. if you don't, you damage your ability to reach the top. And most women, having spent a fortune on their degrees, do NOT want to let them go to waste or work and not achieve full market value for their knowledge and talent. So they choose. And the family suffers.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I want us to at least be honest about the fact that when we choose career, family suffers. But we won't do that. we insist that our family is faring just as well the family where mom chose family first. And it is simply NOT TRUE.

When we are in denial, it's almost impossible to be sure that our hearts ARE in the right place. At least that's what I think. When I worked, I knew that my baby (I had one then) would fare better if I ws at home. But it took me a while to admit it to myself. When I did, it became impossible for me to justify continuing to work.

Terry @ Breathing Grace said...

Heather,

You are right again, my friend. I was never trying to condemn working mothers. I actually made a point of saying that financial realities demand that some families must have two incomes.

Still, I believe that far too many of us don't look hard enough for ways that we can exercise more freedom of choice when it comes to this issue, instead just living on autopilot, doing things the same way everyone else does it. Many times not even praying to the Father to show us a better way, or open a door we hadn't thought of.

Anonymous said...

"I guess what I'm trying to say is that I want us to at least be honest about the fact that when we choose career, family suffers. But we won't do that. we insist that our family is faring just as well the family where mom chose family first. And it is simply NOT TRUE"

I agree 100%!! There are circumstances that can physically take us away from home ( I am thinking of single mom's or even financial reasons.) but we must have our hearts always turned towards our homes. We cannot have family success and personal success.

Heather, I like your thoughts on the P31 Woman and being a slave to your employer. Good stuff to think over.

KJ

Craig and Heather said...

I gotcha Terry--

And I agree with you.

Just hoping to help avert a rabbit trail discussion that misses the main point...We do that here sometimes, you know :o)

Craig and Heather said...

Kyla Jean,

I really love the P31 woman! It is,in my opinion, an excellent way to balance some of the lopsided views of "Titus 2" and mishandled verses concerning "patriarchy". But that is another discussion for another day...

H

Craig and Heather said...

One last comment :D

With regard to my initial statement...I do feel that many of us would not be in a position of slavery today if we had exercised "contentment in Christ" yesterday.

However, they say "hindsight is 20/20" and we all have to learn from our mistakes. God is gracious and will be faithful to teach us through whatever circumstances we get ourselves into.

Thank you, Jesus!

Anonymous said...

Terry,

I just don't see how the verses can be taken to mean a woman should not hold a job outside of the home. One verse is meant to define what each and every woman should be in life? Why would God bless me and others with talents that allow us to hold jobs? (please note, I don't work full-time, I do think working full-time would place much more stress on a family and I'm blessed to have a job in which part-time work is very possible and we can afford it).

And I don't think the decay of the world is do to mothers working. Mothers have always worked. The decay of our society is due to people turning their hearts away from the Lord. And staying home with my child(ren) would not save me or them.

Nurse Bee

Craig and Heather said...

Nurse Bee,

About 7 comments above yours, I posted what I believe to be a Biblically accurate answer to your concern...

Terry indicated that she agrees with my point and I don't see that she is saying "mothers shouldn't work outside the home".

I believe her original post was centered on the amazing way that God will grab an individual's heart in His perfect timing and show that person His truth in a way that leaves no question as to His desire for an individual. And what's even more amazing, we often can get confirmation of the truth because He will be speaking to another individual on exactly the same type of issue and give that person a very similar direction--even though the two had not previously been discussing the subject.

This happens to DH and I a lot lately and I think it is directly related to a reversal of the situation you mentioned. Many people are having their hearts turned back to the Lord and being given specific instruction as we urgently seek His will for our lives.

Anonymous said...

Heather,

I too am such a P31 fan. I could go on and on how that Chapter changed my thoughts and ideas and if I am honest my whole life!!

I will save it for another time.

KJ

God's Dancing Child said...

Terry,
I do see where you are coming from and why you say it regarding working outside of the home.
It still doesn't answer the adiaphora question: if it's "okay" to disobey a *mandate* from God to keep the home to obey a husband, is it then "okay" to use drugs if a husband tells the wife to?
The same logic for the aftermath of "disobedience" to husband in that situation can be used that you mentioned in your reply...
"I believe that the greater sin would be the dissolution of the marriage [......] the stress level reaches a point where the marriage becomes unworkable? And the children become the product of a broken home, and at risk for all of the pathologies that we know come from that? The Bible says that even in an unequally yoked marriage the staying together of that couple sanctifies the children, no?"

It sounds beyond silly when looking at it through the lens of using drugs. But the point of the matter is that we all would tell a wife to refuse to use drugs, yes?
In the aftermath of a husband bent on having his wife use drugs (I've met a husband like that, and they're a real piece of work, let me tell ya) would you tell the wife that it's her "disobedience" to her husband that caused him to be angry with her, caused stress in the home, and made him leave her?
I surely hope not!
But then, why do you call it disobedience to God to "disobey" her husband in something God clearly has said to do (keep the home)? Why would you place the blame on the heart of a wife who obeys God at all costs to keep the home, which He tells us to do, but wouldn't if she obeys God at all costs to not do drugs, which He doesn't come right out in Scripture and tell us to do?

I don't think it needs to be as mucky and miry as you said it can be sometimes. The answers are clear-cut from God (even the adiaphoras if we pay attention), and it's only us and our human emotions and thoughts of "it's not so easy" that make it... well, not easy.
Read God's Word, do what it says by trusting Him, and He will provide. I'm not talking name-it-and-claim-it, I am talking pure faith that God means what He says, and He will not abandon you if He calls you to something.


Heather,
Your thoughts on Proverbs 31 are right up my alley today, and every day!
Currently selling at farmer's market Saturday mornings and making a decent earning so far - my daughter comes along, my husband helps me set-up and tear down, and I made everything I sell with my own hands.
There's nothing more satisfying than having the whole family involved in it as well, and knowing I am bringing in a little bit.
Never for a boss, just for home. :)
Good thoughts. Thank you for sharing.

God's Dancing Child said...

Terry,
I laid awake last night and kept thinking about the implications of what I've been hearing a lot lately... from you and from others. That "sometimes it just can't happen the way He asks us to do it." There have been other ways it's been said, as well, like, "Life is more difficult than it used to be, etc."

I think the implications to that kind of reasoning are tremendous. Firstly, did God not know from the dawn of time how difficult life could be for Adam and Eve all the way to the last group of humans before we are called Home? Did He not know there would be single mothers, widows, wives who would have their husband's ask them to deny God's Word for some sense of financial security (not trusting God's security)? Did God not foresee that?
I believe we can all agree that He did foresee it, yes?

Secondly, if He did foresee it, which He did, would a loving God give a mandate for all wives and mothers to do, but then make it impossible for a single one of them to obey?
I am not saying that it's always going to be easy, because there are many situations that it's so stinking hard to stay at home (financially) that it causes me to weep, such as abandoned wives, etc. But it's not impossible.

God would be sick and twisted if He were to call *all* of us wives to be home (and you yourself said it is a mandate for wives and mothers), and then make it impossible for some to do. If it were "impossible" for some, it would be as though He abandoned them to the wolves, while only caring for those that could "afford" to stay home. As though He ignored those wives/mothers in Scripture. "Keep the home, except for you."

The implications within "for some it's impossible to do" are staggeringly heartbreaking, isolating, and demeaning to the God who gave us all the directives for life as well.

Thirdly, God gave us many, many other mandates for living as well.
Are there extenuating circumstances which make it okay to disobey those things as well?
If money is really tight for a family of God, is it okay for them to slight God at the offering plate? If our spouse stops loving us, is it understandable and forgiveable that we run into the arms of another? If there's no money and no job opportunities are in sight, is it okay to sell drugs or to prostitute ourselves?

The thinking that comes with "for some it's impossible and they can't follow what God tells them to do" is something that comes from the world, not Christ's followers! I am not saying you are not a Christian, because I *know* you are my sister in the Lord - I am saying that this is flawed thinking and that the implications of such are dangerous and isolating for those women that long to be home but feel they "have" to work outside it to make ends meet.
God did not call some wives and mothers to keep the home, but all.

Terry @ Breathing Grace said...

Yes, GDC, I realize that, which is why I took down my most recent post. I don't want to focus on exceptions, though I do believe there are a few. And JUST a few- abandoned wives, single mothers, etc. I believe that God extends grace in the most extreme circumstances, just as He sometimes did in the Bible.

However, and this is where we are on the same page- I think that most of us, if we prayerfully and deliberately decided to be content with our daily NEEDS and put some real energy into being good home managers and responsible stewards of our resources- most familes would find that it is entirely possible to live on one income. It won't be glamorous, no, but it is a blessed life.

I'd be curious to get your input as I begin to examine ways that we can live well on one income. I'm slowly but surely pulling together my thoughts and putting them on paper, but I still have a lot to learn.

Persuaded said...

Great article Terry... I believe that God's best for all women is to be at home, caring for the home and the people that He has placed there with us. I think this is true even for *single* women. I know this is drastically out of step with what the culture, and even most within the church believe, but my feeling is that if being a keeper at home is God's best for the married woman, it is His best for the unmarried. And the need for a stay at home parent is that much more intense for the children of single women.

I think I'd like your friend☺

mrvelocity said...

I often hear that even single mothers can stay home in desperate, nearly impossible situations from people virulently opposed to welfare and medicaid and such. Something doesn't click there for me.

God's Dancing Child said...

Voddie Baucham put it well when referencing to single-parent adoption, but I think it's a perfect way to talk about this situation of working outside the home being called "not-so-ideal to break a mandate of God" as well...

"The fact that God can use ‘less-than-ideal’ circumstances is an argument for his providence, not an excuse to 'put the Lord your God to the test.' (Matthew 4:7 ESV)"